Marty's Pissed Off!

Jason · 00:00Welcome to episode 165 of The Numbers Game. I'm Jase. I'm here with Nick and Marty. How are we fellas?

Marty · 00:07Going well, mate. Uh, I'm a bit shocked actually, a bit stunned. Went out for breakfast with the good wife yesterday and Charlie, and um, just ordered some eggs on toast and a coffee each, and Charlie had some waffles.

Marty · 00:2097 bucks. 97 bucks. Out of East too. Out of East. So, that um, I sort of, you know, after being shocked, talked to the owner and just said, why, why so high for eggs and a piece of toast and some coffee? He just goes, it's just cost of labor. He goes, uh, you know, it's, it's, uh, we have to put the prices up to that level.

Marty · 00:45So yeah, I was a bit stunned. I wanted to give him some money, obviously, just not that much, but the eggs were good. It was a good fight, but, um, interesting anyway, I'm all right. I've recovered. I've recovered. Nick,

Nick · 00:57how are you? Uh, I'm going well.

Nick · 01:00Going well. Just wondering, um, if you spend 97 on the good wife, where does the bad wife come in?

Nick · 01:0750,

Nick · 01:0760? I don't

Marty · 01:10know if I should answer that

Marty · 01:11on

Marty · 01:13a public forum, but, uh, definitely a lot cheaper. Definitely a lot cheaper.

Nick · 01:19No, I'm going well. Look, I really resonate with what you're saying. Well, I just, um, not that I refuse to go out for breakfast, that's, that's the wrong word, but just don't go out for breakfast much anymore because it's, it's the one meal that I think you can do just as well at home, um, and really bloody quickly, um, mind you, we do, we do go out for breakfast sometimes, but it's not a regular thing anymore because you just, you just can't comprehend the money.

Nick · 01:43I know that he mentioned wages and whatnot, but it's still, it's still never going to add up in my head that you've got to spend a hundred bucks on, you know. Three pretty simple meals. Um, it's just, it's just ludicrous. Jay should be a, um, a waffle man.

Jason · 01:59Uh,

Jason · 02:00no, absolutely not waffles. I like my, uh, I'm a Bernard Salt man.

Jason · 02:04Uh, abo on toast, smashed abo on toast, uh, the old Bernard Salt, uh, story. If anyone doesn't know that, have a quick Google. But, um, funny you mentioned that Marty, cause Case and I stopped at a pizza place or I shouldn't say pizza. It's called Pinsa. It's like a special type of pizza. It's in St. Kilda and excuse me, is this

Marty · 02:20sort of hot dog and sausage and bread story?

Marty · 02:23Pinsa? Did you say?

Jason · 02:25Pinsa. Pinsa. It's a special type of pizza, special base, 72 hours, whatever. Like don't get me wrong. Epic pizza. 20 percent surcharge. Well, the, I think for Case and I, we just wanted a quick dinner when we're leaving an appointment Friday night. So two pizzas and two Peroni reds, and it was yeah, 80 or 90.

Jason · 02:42And it was like, oof, like that. Stung for a quick takeaway dinner that stung the pocket a lot more than what I'd mentally been prepared for You know when you think about a couple of takeaway pizzas in a box and you cruise out you don't expect to be dropping You know 80 90 50 bucks Yeah, correct. So

Jason · 03:00I hear you, Marty.

Jason · 03:01I hear you and we've probably built in this episode to be talking about, you know, expenses and high costs and everything else. Uh, so I'm intrigued to where we're going with this, Marty. What have we got planned for this episode?

Marty · 03:13Well, I'm just pissed off with the Victorian debt. Levels. I, I just totally pissed off.

Marty · 03:20It's, you know, we're at 55.2 billion in 2019 and Yeah, I know Covid cost us 31 bill, but we're gonna be at 247 bill in the next year and a half to two years. It's just, it's just outta control. I, I mean, and the number is, we're gonna be paying $40 million a day in interest. On that debt. And I'm just putting two and two together and trying to work out how the hell do we get out of this as Victorians, like we're going to be paying this off for generations.

Marty · 03:56And I'm looking at, and I know growth changes, but you know,

Marty · 04:00we're trying to bring inflation down. The growth rates only looking to be about 1. 5 percent of the maximum over the next 12, 18 months. And I just don't know how we're going to do it. I mean, you can't take more money off people that don't have it.

Marty · 04:16Which is what they're trying to do. And then you can't take more money off people that are making the upside because they're going to go and invest somewhere else. You know, all this land tax that we're having to pay, you know, like I went, I mean, it's a crazy scenario, but I went into buy a new suit at, um, you know, Roger David, just, you know, your classical outer East nice threads.

Marty · 04:39Right. But, um, but I went in there and. I said, you know, how much, how much for the suit? There's this usual suit I usually buy. And I said, well, it's actually 40 percent off. It's down from 750 to 400 bucks. And I go, I said, I've actually never paid for a suit at 400. It's always been about 550 at least for the last, you know, 10 years or

Marty · 05:00so.

Marty · 05:00And he said, well, we have to, we have to move stock. So even though we're not making the margins we'd usually make, we still have to get the turnover to let the business run. But all we're doing is not hiring people. We're putting off the labor because again, the cost is in the labor. And I'm gone, geez, this is really interesting.

Marty · 05:18When you start banking up, the unemployment right now is over 4%. And I know the government wants to sort of cap it out. And I think nationally, they want to cap that out around 4. 5 percent as a maximum, but you got low growth rates. You've got the fear of inflation. So they don't want to stimulate the economy.

Marty · 05:37But that means they're just gonna take money off the table that's that's there already from us And I just don't know and I'm don't get me wrong. I'm yeah, I'm pissed at Dan Andrews But I'm also pissed at the Liberals for not holding the damn thing accountable because you know it it It just should not happen to this

Marty · 06:00degree.

Marty · 06:00And to see the, the debt go from 55 billion to it being 247 billion in the next 18 months is just criminal. It just, I just can't fiscally get that through my head how this could happen. Sorry, guys, I just, no, no, no, I love it. And I'm going to

Jason · 06:18allow you to get more annoyed in a minute, but to unpack that 40 million a day in interest repayments.

Jason · 06:24So the government needs to find just to service the debt, we'll be finding between 14 and 15 billion a year, just in interest repayments. So when you think about the amount of revenue, the government needs to collect from Victorians who live and pay tax in Victoria. That is a. Just astronomical amount of money that needs to be taken off everyday Victorians, not, not Australians, this is a Victorian state debt, which means land tax, state revenue office, payroll tax, all these different things that we're being

Jason · 07:00hit with.

Jason · 07:01This is why, you know, in a couple of early episodes we talked about, you know, does eventually capital gains tax come off the, come off the cards. I mean, that's at a national level when we redistributed, but this is where all these taxes to the everyday Australians. I mean, you know, it used to be what was it the state, the place to be, was the old number plate thing on Victoria?

Jason · 07:24And, you know, Victoria was the number one state after COVID that had a mass exodus. We had more people leaving the state than coming to the state after COVID. And, you know, we're meant to be in the top 10 best places in the world to live, but all of a sudden the numbers just don't quite stack up as a state when, and as you said, Marty, from poor management point of view, how does, how does that happen?

Jason · 07:46If this was a business, if this was any, anything else, you know, Well, it's just, where's the accountability? That's exactly right, Marty.

Nick · 07:55There doesn't seem to be any. Um, and the reality is you could go around

Nick · 08:00in circles here, but, um, we just don't have the right people in politics because who'd want to do it.

Nick · 08:07Most smart people, and we've spoken, I'm sure we've spoken about this, but most smart people realise they can make more money elsewhere. Um, so we get, uh, we get numpties, um, that, uh, that run, that run the countries and the states. But I just think, to your point around the number, Marty, I just think, just numbers are so almost irrelevant now.

Nick · 08:26Like, the world has moved so much that, These big numbers, you know, a millionaire used to be a big thing. Now, how many people are billionaires? And now we've got, you know, um, a cashless society and we've got crypto and what are numbers really mean? You know, that's, that's the challenge. And, uh, do you know what the, the total U S debt is at the moment?

Nick · 08:47No, it'd be trillions, wouldn't it? 34 trillion. The crazy thing in the U S is a lot of that money's borrowed some from super funds and whatnot, or their version of super funds. So you've actually got the

Nick · 09:00people of the U S lending back to the U S. It's just, it's just like, I don't know, it's crazy, but yeah, to, to your point, Jase, it's just any business, there would be ramifications.

Nick · 09:11Well, number one, it'd probably be shut down. I know you can't shut a state down, but, um, yeah, where, where, where does it end and how do you, and I know it's all relative, but how do you claw your way back? Like I get taxes and all that sort of stuff, but we're a long way back.

Marty · 09:28Cause you still got to invest in infrastructure, given population growth.

Nick · 09:33Yeah, you can't just stop spending. Yeah. Correct. So you can't

Marty · 09:37just stop spending. So it's like, you've got to create significant growth and they don't want to do that because then inflation sparks back up and can cause a problem too. So they have to manage this cycle effectively yet I'm going, well, we need growth in order to pay back the debt.

Marty · 09:54So it's, it's, it's a real conundrum. The more I'm contemplating it, I just

Marty · 10:00go, I'm not quite sure what the way out is. And like you said, it could be years.

Jason · 10:04And the thing is, and this is where it gets kind of interesting when you go as a state, how we're going to stack up over the coming five, 10 years. And then maybe why, if we dig a bit deeper into why and where the money's been spent.

Jason · 10:17You look at infrastructure, schools, hospitals. Um, all of this planning for a bigger population moving to Melbourne. So between now and 2033, we're meant to go from 6. 5 million people in Melbourne to 8. 5 million people in Melbourne. Uh, we're meant to have a bigger population than Sydney within 10 years.

Jason · 10:37We're going to overtake Sydney as Australia's biggest capital city. Then you go, I look at the roads, public transport, traffic, hospital system, schools, apparently like, you know, we're overrun everywhere. So the question, and then even with, um, construction companies going into liquidation, cost of materials, cost of labor, in what world does it make sense that

Jason · 11:00we expand from 6.

Jason · 11:015 million to 8. 5 million and, you know, bring in more, I guess, more population and continue to grow. and continue to expand the debt. And then this is the bit where then how does that end up getting paid back? It is the taxes, the new Victorian land taxes, the new property taxes. Um, but then you think if we've got this thing where we need people to be developing and, and putting wealth and prosperity into Victoria to grow, you know, infrastructure and build properties, but you want to make it the highest tax state, wouldn't you be better off taking your money to a different state and investing it?

Jason · 11:34Elsewhere, if you're not going to pay as much tax, it's happening. So it's, it's kind of counterintuitive, but it's, and that's,

Nick · 11:40that's happening. You've got, uh, investors in this state. We spoke about this selling properties because it's, it just doesn't make sense to hold them anymore. And we're seeing our clients on the finance side that are now investing in, we've been investing in Queensland for quite some time.

Nick · 11:55They're starting to invest in Perth now because the returns are better, Adelaide as well, or

Nick · 12:00South Australia. So it's happening now and yeah, you've got investors selling, you've got an increased rent, increasing the rental crisis, and they're deterring investors from wanting to build properties. Like it's just crazy.

Nick · 12:15Um, so who makes these decisions? Like if we can sit here and say, it's common sense. Yeah, then it's obvious they're obviously stupid if it's common sense.

Jason · 12:26So I was gonna say from a state government decision, you know, I don't know if you guys heard over the weekend, um, Jackie Felgate brought it up and it kind of did the rounds online.

Jason · 12:35Um, but there's an article from over 10 months ago and it's still empty. The government spent 1. 1 billion building a new prison just outside of Geelong. It's been empty for the last year. It costs 36 million to continue to run, leaving it empty. The air conditioners are running. Um, you know, but, but there's no prisoners in there.

Jason · 12:57But it costs 1. 1 billion to

Jason · 13:00build. It's been operational, like as in turned on and power and air conditioning and, you know, a few little training, um, runs through there. It costs 36 million to sit vacant over the last year. But we also got crime running rampant in all these suburbs where home invasions of cars are being stalled.

Jason · 13:16So again, what kind of decision making is this?

Marty · 13:20But why isn't it, why isn't it filled?

Jason · 13:22They, they don't have the people to work it. Apparently, they don't have enough, uh, jobs filled. So now they need to hire people and train people, and they're struggling to fill the roles and do the training that they need, um, to have enough prison officers to then warrant filling it up.

Jason · 13:38And I think it's meant to be a, it's actually meant to be a youth, um, youth, uh, Jail, crime, prison. Well, there's

Marty · 13:46a great future plan for Victoria. Just to,

Nick · 13:49yeah. It just goes on and on, you know, you've got the, the desal plant that's sitting there, that's was I think 4 billion or something. Like why not just build more dams or get the catchment,

Nick · 14:00you know, sort of look, like, look at the rainfall that we've had in the last couple of years.

Nick · 14:04The last thing we need is, is a desal plant. The Commonwealth games. The thing that got me about the games is. Why were we taking it regional? I get, I get the incentive to build up regional areas, but why were we trying to build stadiums in Geelong for the Commonwealth games when we've got probably the best, one of the best, um, sports precincts in the world in, in Melbourne?

Nick · 14:27That's just stupid. And it's all vote. It was all vote, vote grabbing, you know? So it's, this is the issue with politics and everyone knows this, but they don't, you know, they're only thinking about themselves and their own tenure. They're not thinking about what is absolutely best. For the state, the country, the world, absolute long term.

Marty · 14:47And I'll just add to that, what Jase was saying, like, I was thinking about the roads yesterday on Sunday, you go for a nice Sunday drive. Yeah, you can drive around like I was driving through Ringwood, it was bumper to bumper. It

Marty · 15:00was literally bumper to bumper with the volumes of people we have now. And I had a look at some of the future Victorian land planning acts as to what they're doing.

Marty · 15:09And they're just going up. In the out of suburbs, they talk about these 20 minute type cities where even in Blackburn, they're building apartments and they've got those Jeffries, which is a new type of supermarket at the bottom. So people could walk there. So the only thing I'm thinking, obviously, they're going to have to invest so heavily in, in transport, or they try and keep people within vicinities.

Marty · 15:32But I guess they must be bringing people in with money to buy these apartments and get tax revenue through, through that. I'm just trying to, in my own head, thinking, how are they trying to create the upside? But it must be just doing stuff like that, because otherwise you just, you just don't see a way out.

Marty · 15:53Has to be something like that, because they're making some good money on the taxes ultimately. But. Geez, I'll tell you why I wouldn't want to get

Marty · 16:00any more busier. I've got to

Nick · 16:02do something. Particularly at the moment. It's a nightmare trying to go anywhere. There's that much happening, obviously with the East West link and whatnot, but

Jason · 16:09wasn't one of those contracts ripped up at the cost of a billion dollars.

Jason · 16:12The East West link, another one. Yeah. And then I think there's the rail to the airport that's on standby at the moment due to cost blowout. So there's been X amount of dollars invested in that. So, and, and,

Nick · 16:24and we are so far behind like to think that we don't have a rail network. Into the city from our airport.

Nick · 16:31It's crazy. Like for Melbourne being the city it is, but we are so far behind. In the fact that we don't have that. Um, and now it's not even in the works, you know,

Marty · 16:41I almost feel like we need another party, like a liquidator to come in and just put the state back together and make sure there's a feasible way out.

Marty · 16:54I've lost a lot of trust. We've been locked down four times the amount of any other state.

Marty · 17:00And, uh, and look, I look at it and I go, everyday people. You know, interest rates as high as they've ever been. The productivity is down. People are working more hours and productivity's down. That's because people are getting sacked at the moment.

Marty · 17:15Other people have to, you know, have to do the work that needs to be done. So obviously, you know, a few mental health issues as well with that. So it's not like people aren't having a crack in Victoria. They absolutely are. And I think they just need to be supported by something that's, you know, with, with discipline and, and numbers stacking up in their favor and some, again, they can sell hope, but without optimism and a clear plan out of this, you know, I'm not hearing about the upside plan.

Marty · 17:46I just want to hear an upside plan. To really show us that the strength in the state that we, you know, we deserve ultimately. So it needs to be some vision really. Anyway, I'm sorry guys. Just on the high horse.

Jason · 17:59Dude, did we touch,

Jason · 18:00we might've said it, the suburban rail loop, that was the one that's cost 35 billion so far out of that 250 billion debt we're in.

Jason · 18:07A lot of it comes from this suburban rail loop. Now I don't know about you guys, but I'm not too sure who that's solving a problem for like people getting from. You know, Bayside to Ringwood, uh, Marty, does the suburban rail loop help you, mate?

Marty · 18:21Oh, mate, something's got to help me. I mean, at the end of the day, I'm 20 K's away.

Marty · 18:26It takes me an hour 20 to get here in the West Melbourne from out, out of East. I just go, come on, you know, it just shouldn't be the case. Well, I think that's

Jason · 18:36forecast to cost 125 billion alone. So if we keep on going the way we're going with just that one project costing 125 billion. If you reduce

Marty · 18:48taxes and I'll, you know, I'll pay the toll, get to work in, you know, 20, 25 minutes happily, happily give us something.

Marty · 18:59Come on,

Marty · 19:00you can do it. Uh, well, I feel like

Jason · 19:02it's been like a one, one really good wind session, but I guess, uh, ultimately what we might need to get out of this is not just venting, but, uh, when we go to the polls eventually one day, these are the kinds of things we need to consider on who we vote in. What they're doing for us, uh, as the people of Victoria and, and, and taxpayers.

Jason · 19:19And, you know, interesting for anyone who's interstate listening to this bit of a wind session, uh, that it has been, um, love to hear what you think of your, uh, state politicians and state governments. And if you've got any thoughts on our Victorian wind session, uh, feel free to contact Nick, Marty, or I drop us an email.

Jason · 19:35Hello at the numbers game podcast. com. au. Um, you know, Nick, Marty, any solutions right now, or just frustrations, any thoughts?

Nick · 19:43This is just frustrations. No, we're not here to give solutions. We're here to vent. I didn't know you wanted solutions. We're just here to complain.

Marty · 19:52But if this was, yeah, if it's our business, we jump straight onto it, right?

Marty · 19:57And create the upside, create a plan around

Marty · 20:00it and, you know, find, find a way through. I think it's, yeah, like I said, when you lack control, you naturally get frustrated. Things aren't working your way. Um, but that's, that's why I guess we're venting. But. I think we need, yeah, you're right, Jase, we need someone to come up with something really optimistic, really factual, that we can see a way out here, so we know that the hours everyone's putting in, in this state is going towards, yeah, a better, brighter future, you know, get a new number plate, you know, we're going somewhere, Vic, you know, something, anything.

Marty · 20:33The

Nick · 20:33only solution that I would have is leaning more on high profile, successful people. Business people, a lot of them are lenient with their time and a lot of them want to see things done well. Um, so, you know, instead of taking the likes of Kerry Packer to, to court over his tax, maybe, maybe consult with someone like Kerry Packer, um, who's a, you know, who's an

Nick · 21:00amazing business person that's done good things.

Nick · 21:01So you just, you're never going to get those people into, to government. Um, but maybe. Maybe there's a way that they can work well together, um, to make sure the right things or the right decisions are made. Like an advisory board. I'm

Marty · 21:14sure you'd think that they'd be doing that, but you're right. It's maybe who they're selecting in that, um, that, that needs to change.

Nick · 21:22There'd be some element of that, but it's not working the way it is, but. You think of the great minds that we have in business.

Jason · 21:27Well, yeah, you imagine Mark Burris, um, sitting on that, that board, you know, Mark Burris, you know, is quite often quite outspoken on, on these things. But, you know, if our government were leaning on great business minds, entrepreneurs that have been there, done that and care about the population and the people in it, um.

Jason · 21:45You know, I think if there was KPIs and accountability to our politicians, rather than retiring and getting, you know, three, 400 grand for the rest of their lives, like Mr. Dan Andrews is sitting back on a, on a healthy three or 400, 000 a year salary to just ride

Jason · 22:00the wave of retirement. Um, if there was KPIs that said you had to do a decent job while you're in power, um, you know, potentially that'd work, work smarter and work better with our money.

Marty · 22:10Well, there you go. You've just nailed it in one. One key sentence, give them some performance KPIs to hit, um, to get your benefits.

Jason · 22:19Always underlying lessons when you listen to the numbers game, KPIs, performance metrics, that's what we need.

Marty · 22:24I think you nailed it, Jase. I think I'm satisfied off the back of this discussion.

Marty · 22:28There's a way forward and we are open to being on that advisory board. Uh, so if you're listening out there, just, uh, Give us a call.

Jason · 22:37Yep. So ignore all of the shit talking we've done about the government. Get us onto the panel. Let us help make Victoria and Australia a better place. Uh, if you have, we are open and ready for business.

Jason · 22:48Uh, speaking of, uh, the lovely team at Future Advisory and at Innovate are always here to support you, uh, unlike our government supporting us. Uh, but yeah, so if you need anything, please Peel,

Jason · 23:00please feel free to reach out to Nick, Marty, or I and our teams always happy to help. And until next time, though, like share support, give us your ratings, click, follow online, jump on Instagram and check out our mugs on our faces on Instagram or even full length clips of our episodes are now available on YouTube.

Jason · 23:19So go and search the numbers game podcast and check that out. But until next time, winge over and Marty

Marty · 23:26Victorians. It's not game over. It's game on. Let's get on it. | **ASSET NAME** | **LINK** | | --- | --- | | Episode Audio | [https://drive.google.com/file/d/1U7OHfF7zzSuAujg3v-u9dZmmRdnwwdyo/view?usp=sharing](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1U7OHfF7zzSuAujg3v-u9dZmmRdnwwdyo/view?usp=sharing) | | Video Snippets | [https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1CvIHdNa43m1hMw32a0GQMFkPje0H_97p?usp=drive_link](https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1CvIHdNa43m1hMw32a0GQMFkPje0H_97p?usp=drive_link) | | Youtube Link | [https://youtu.be/fOm_jg0Nfqk](https://youtu.be/fOm_jg0Nfqk) | | Youtube Embed | | | Simplecast Embed | <iframe height="200px" width="100%" frameborder="no" scrolling="no" seamless src="[https://player.simplecast.com/ddda6de7-34da-48e0-b1b1-a2e9cb67620b?dark=false](https://player.simplecast.com/ddda6de7-34da-48e0-b1b1-a2e9cb67620b?dark=false)"></iframe> | | | | ::: ---